THE BMW ActiveE FORUM

[mcadieux52]

Has anyone thought about, or even gone so far as to investigate the options regarding Public Charging stations as an investment?

I live about 60 miles outside of Boston, and when I do a search of ChargePoint locations I come up with practically nothing? I'm wondering about potentially putting a couple up along my major highways in order to increase access. I know the Mass Dept of Energy ReSources is putting about 25-30 into some of the Municipalities around MA, but it seems that none are coming to my area

Has anyone looked into a cost model and operational investment model for these things yet? And if so would you be willing to share your findings? It seems like the big players are AV and Coulomb. As an owner of the AV home Unit, I'm ok with it, but wondering about the Coulomb models.

many thanks for thoughts and input.
Mike C.

[dennis]

Originally Posted by mcadieux52

Has anyone thought about, or even gone so far as to investigate the options regarding Public Charging stations as an investment?

I live about 60 miles outside of Boston, and when I do a search of ChargePoint locations I come up with practically nothing? I'm wondering about potentially putting a couple up along my major highways in order to increase access. I know the Mass Dept of Energy ReSources is putting about 25-30 into some of the Municipalities around MA, but it seems that none are coming to my area

Has anyone looked into a cost model and operational investment model for these things yet? And if so would you be willing to share your findings? It seems like the big players are AV and Coulomb. As an owner of the AV home Unit, I'm ok with it, but wondering about the Coulomb models.

many thanks for thoughts and input.
Mike C.

I have a Coulomb CT500 at home that's great.

I typically use AE, Blink, Clipper Creek, and Coulomb (Chargepoint) public charge stations in my normal driving around LA. (the AE is at the BMW dealership near my work... My company's landlord is working with someone (haven't been able to get the model or company from them) to get some public charge stations installed in our office building. It seems from my conversations with the landlord that the costs seem reasonable, but no detail squeezed out of them yet.) [added an hour later] - Looks landlord is working with CCGI. Anyone have any experience with them.

Seeing that they were originally going to charge me $1.5k just for the wiring and installation to my parking spot for a plug for an SPX L2 portable charger, I figure that their costs might be lower.

[Kirby]

Originally Posted by mcadieux52

Has anyone thought about, or even gone so far as to investigate the options regarding Public Charging stations as an investment?
Mike C.

Do you mean buying/installing chargers as a business? It did cross my mind. Install costs would depend on the unit. If you figure $5K per charger, you'd have to bring in about $7/day for a 2 year payback. If you charged $2/hour, it could be done on one or two cars per day. You might be able to get govt. incentives to offset the initial cost.

A big factor is finding suitable locations. Prime locations would be in-between population centers. When I'm within 40 miles of the house, I don't need to charge. If I go further, I'm usually on the outskirts where charging is less available. That is exactly where chargers for 100 mile range cars need to be located. A popular charger would be near a restaurant, shopping, or some other place where drivers can pass the time.

Of course, in a few years, quick chargers will probably make level 2 chargers obsolete in outlying areas, so you'd have a limited window on the investment.

[TomMoloughney]

Personally I think the only way to actually make money with public charging is through advertising. Many of the new public EVSE's will have the ability to have digital advertising on the unit. For instance you pull up and activate the EVSE, it asks you would you like to view coupons for local businesses (preferably ones that are in walking distance since your car is charging) you then can print, for free coupons to restaurants, movie theaters, shops, etc, with discounts.

Electricity is just too cheap to really make money off it. Plus many states don't let you sell electricity, so you have to charge for the privilege of parking in the space, not for the electricity. How much can you really charge and have people use it? If it costs you $4.00 to fill up at home will you pay $8.00 at a public charger? How about $10 or $20? An EV can 'hog' a charger all day, how can the site make money on it? You can't! The way to make money on public chargers is through advertising. GE's yet to be released public Wattstation EVSE s based on advertising. I was at an event last year and attended a seminar sponsored by GE and it was very interesting. The future EVSE's are going to be much more complex that what you see now, and they are coming very soon.

[mcadieux52]

Tom,
I tend to agree with you, I don't think the ROI is there, nor do I think the window of opportunity is large enough given the speed to market on the Rapid Charging options that I'm reading about. Seems like they will "in market" sooner rather than later.

That said I agree with you that the logical monitization of public charging must be via advertising. In fact I would go so far as to say, that advertisers could be persuaded to offset someones charging fees if the person charging was to say, join a loyalty program of if they actually used the "coupon" at the local vendor. Almost in the same spirit of validating your parking in the local garrage if you dine at a restaurant in some Metro locations.

There certainly are plenty of prime locations still available. Has anyone heard of this group in NJ,,,,U-Go Stations? Seems like the right model.

[Kirby]

Gas stations don't make much money selling gasoline because there's very low margins. They make more money selling snacks and drinks because those items have higher margins.

Perhaps a car charger/vending machine?

[TomMoloughney]

Originally Posted by Kirby

Gas stations don't make much money selling gasoline because there's very low margins. They make more money selling snacks and drinks because those items have higher margins.

Perhaps a car charger/vending machine?

You're right about that, but gas stations can service hundreds, if not thousands(large highway locations) of cars in a day because they can service a car in 5 minutes. So even if they only make a dollar or two per car it adds up. If an EV is parked at a level 2 charge station for three to five hours while it's charging, it's taking up a lot of space for a long time. Even if the converted gas station had two dozen chargers, they couldn't possibly make money there unless they charged a lot for a charge, like $10/hr or something like that and who want's to pay $10 for $1 in electricity.

If you want to talk about level 3 DCquick charge, it get way more expensive to break even as a site manager because of the high cost of the equipment and the demand charges from utilities. EVen then, a car will take about a half hour to get an 80% charge. So you would really need more than a couple QC stations or people may need to wait hours just to get connected and nobody will accept that. Public charging has a lot of challenges, I beleive only by using advertising does it have a chance to have a successful business model.

[Go Ducks]

Besides advertising I think businesses that already have a long length of stay (shopping centers, gyms, movie theaters) can make a market share/ loyalty play by providing EVSEs. I can tell you for certain that if I need to run an errand at a mall, I go to South Coast Plaza because I can charge up at the same time, whereas before I might have gone to a center 4 or 5 miles closer to home. I don't necessarily spend more time there than other customers, usually in he 45-90 min range, I don't camp out there or go specifically to charge, it's more of a convenience. But they gained market share from me. I agree that as a standalone business there's probably not much to be made.